WORLD WORLDWIDE BELARUS PRAMEN News Journal Update - (en) Belarus, Pramen: AN INTERVIEW WITH A BELARUSSIAN ANARCHIST WHO WAS INVOLVED IN ORGANIZING WOMEN'S MARCHES IN 2020 (ca, de, it, pt, tr)[machine translation]

 Today we interview Sveta, an anarchist activist who was involved in organizing

women's marches in 2020. The conversation with Sveta is an attempt once again to
draw attention to different sides of the protest movement, and in these difficult
times to remember that women played an extremely important role in the uprising
against the Lukashenko regime. ---- Pramen: Sveta, can you start by telling us a
little about yourself for our readers? What were you doing before August 2020? In
what format were you involved in the anarchist movement, and why did you choose
anarchism out of all the political camps?

Sveta: It's very simple for me, my teenage subcultures got me into anarchism When
I was in high school my friends and I got acquainted with local punks, there were
a lot of anarchists and anti-fascists in their community. That's how it went. At
first I was studying the history of the skinhead movement, all the values about
respecting people around you, not judging people by the color of their skin and
the color of their passports, helping those who are weaker than you. In 2010 I
went to Minsk to study, and I was looking for the same kind of community. In
Minsk, it seemed to me, it was not like in my city: everything was in one pile.
In Minsk, everyone was in their own community: anarchists, punks, hardcore,
antifa - and then when necessary, at concerts or rallies, everyone met and merged
into one. It so happened that I joined the anarchists right away, and I liked
that, they were all idealists, they believed in a better world and did a lot of
things, not just talked about. So I studied and worked and was active in feminism
and anarchism until 2020, and then I was sentenced to short term arrests several
times before the summer of 2020, when I decided that I needed a break from the
hustle and bustle.

P: So in the summer of 2020 you decided that you needed to take a break from
activism, and the result was women's marches? Did you participate in protests
before the women's marches, and if so, in what form?

S: Yes, I decided that I wouldn't go anywhere because I'd already seen it: a few
people would come out, they'd lock us all up for 24 hours, and in five days
everyone would forget about it except the human rights activists. On August 9 I
did not go anywhere, but from 10 I was actively involved in everything I could.

I don't know if I believed that this time we would be able to overthrow the
dictator. I wanted to be involved in the help and protests, I knew that I will
never forgive myself if I do not go out. And, in fact, there was never even a
thought in my mind that I would not get out when things started to take on such
proportions. It wasn't that I didn't want to go out because I knew we were going
to jail for some days, because I had that experience and it scared me. It's just
that at that time I somehow had no moral strength at all in life, you could say
that there was a burnout.

P: What was your reaction to the state violence in the early days of the protest?
How did the idea of organizing a women's march come about, and how was the format
for the action determined?

S: I remember only anger and pain from the reactions, that no one deserved such
treatment.

At first, a group of activists and some other people (they weren't
anarcho-activists) decided to do "Komarovka," as a response to violence, through
a telegram chat. Because the state patriarchy at the time could not bash women so
openly. I'm sure there was hell going on at Okrestino for any gender. But
publicly, beating women with flowers in white dresses like that, "he" would not
have dared. Women's "Komarovka" stirred up a wave of women's actions across the
country. The telegram chat about "Komarovka" was deleted for security reasons the
very day after the action, or maybe even earlier. But after that, a wave of
women's action chat rooms started. There were a few big ones, about three or
four, and a lot of local, small ones, up to 100 women. It seemed to me then that
this was just a well anarchist approach, everything was very horizontal.

Action at Komarovka. Poster says "you can't be nice with violence"
Then, on August 13, I decided to create a telegram channel GIRLS POWER BELARUS in
parallel to the chats that were there. Because my anarchist experience told me to
do it all just a little bit safer, despite the feeling of "we're about to win"
and "what are we doing that's so dangerous".

So I helped out with the chats to publicize some women's local actions in the
district, and I also ran a channel to get women's news about the protests. I've
always wanted to create something like that, because I already had experience
with Telegram channels and I liked this platform for such projects.

At some point, after a small number of days, I thought I needed to find the women
who were doing the Komarovka chat and the whole organization.  I wrote on the
channel that I was looking for them - we corresponded and they told me they had
an idea for marches. I suggested to them that it would be cool to do
announcements on the channel, and that I could help with PR.

So the marches began. As I recall, they were as an alternative to the traditional
Sunday marches. After Komarovka, I wanted to show that the female voice had an
extension. For me, the Komarovka was that we were coming out for those who had
suffered greatly at Okrestino, mostly men. I heard that many came out for a
husband, for a brother, for a friend, for a partner. And the marches were women
coming out for themselves.

The first march was historic, very different women came out: feminists,
activists, non-feminists and non-activists, and all were united by the idea of
showing themselves, their voice, their message. It was beautiful, women supported
women regardless of their views.

We had a very horizontal organization inside the marches: we consulted, we
criticized openly and honestly, we created ideas, we all had our own functions,
and at the same time these functions were taken up by other women if they needed
help. I remember this time fondly, even though we were not close with all the
members of the organizing team.

We didn't have any leaders:)))) It's a nightmare for the regime when there are no
leaders...

P: Self-organization played an extremely important role in the protest movement
as a whole. How was decentralization treated within the movement? Already in
August 2020, many people were looking for new "leaders" for the protest. Was the
same thing happening within the women's march group?

S: No, there was no such thing at all: women were not looking for leaders when
organizing themselves. I don't remember this even in the chats, which I had
nothing to do with as an organizer. There were times when someone might say I
like this person and I like that person as a politician. But that didn't affect
the organization and communication within the group at all.

There were values: women's voice, against violence, adequacy

Freedom, Equality, Sisterhood
Women during protests in 2020
P: The mood changed a lot during the protests. From "we won" to "we have to be
more radical". Some people tried to blame the peaceful women's protests for the
failures, saying that they were an example of what the Sunday marches later
became. Were there discussions within your group about this? How did people take
criticism and what was done about it?

S: The rhetoric that the women's peaceful marches prevented the radical
liberation of Belarus came much later than the marches, I think in year 22? We
weren't organizing anything at that time, there was no such criticism at the time
of organizing.

I personally think that perhaps, if it were not for Komarovka, there would not
have been any marches/actions at all: neither radical, nor light. And then,
chronologically, the Sunday marches happened, and only then the women's marches
on Saturdays. It pains me, too, that the dictatorship was not destroyed in 2020,
it pains me to live in exile, and the number of torture and political prisoners.
But that's no reason to blame anyone for protesting the wrong way. To analyze and
draw conclusions that might benefit for the future, yes.

But in general I'm used to it, a woman is always to blame: both that she made the
marches, and if she hadn't, she's to blame for the fact of her existence.

P: At first there was relatively little repression against women's marches. Over
time, this changed to mass detentions. What was the reaction within the
organizing group and the broader women's community to the repression?

S: We knew it was going to happen. We just didn't know how soon. At one of the
marches the women broke through the ranks of the OMON and went wherever they
wanted, not listening to their instructions and they were not touched. From one
of the marches we got a series of pictures of the women walking very nicely and
smiling into the vans. It was inspiring for sure.

The reaction itself, to be honest, I don't remember the repression at all.
Sadness, stamp, longing, rage - some mixture of such feelings. Maybe I don't
remember it yet, because they came for me at that moment, I managed to leave the
country, and it was something I in my naivety had not expected in any way.
Political emigration from the country so as not to go to jail in a criminal case
was the last thing I thought about, and one of the first things I encountered.
Marfa Rabkova had just been jailed.

I left and fell into a wild melancholy, got out of all chats for a while, came to
my friends in another country and lay on their couch for a week with tears
pouring out of my eyes. That is, I was not crying my eyes out. And I read the
news, how every day more and more were taken away for short term arrests, for
felonies. I remember the endless pain, even now I say it and the tears roll up.
So I was going through a personal hell and I just forgot what was being said
around me.

Detention of women protesters in 2020
P: After all this time, have any organizational structures survived and how do
you assess the work of the women's movement as a whole during this period? What
was good and what was not so good?

S: Now there are no organizational structures left as they were. But they are
essentially unnecessary. Of the good things, GPB's telegram channel became a
media project, ran from August 13 to the present day, did several campaigns to
help women and produced a lot of news and positions with feminist criticism.

I think we worked very well together in that period and did a great job in a
short amount of time.

What would I have changed? I probably would have done things on an even larger
scale. But that's me speaking from the experience I have now.

Of the good and the bad at the same time: we do not and have not had a public
face, a spokeswoman who could comment and show more political and feminist or
just women's bias and the meaning of the actions. So the meaning was interpreted
by whoever wanted it.

P: How do you assess the role of women's participation in the protests in
general? What would you say to those who keep trying to attack the women's
marches from the position that they were too peaceful and so on?

S: Certainly the women's protest has gone down in history. In my opinion, the
women's protests were able to prolong the protests in the streets. As I said,
women couldn't be beaten or arrested so publicly at first, and while they were
deciding what to do about women's marches and how to repress them, women came out
and took to the streets. Women had the right to express themselves the way they
wanted: peacefully or aggressively. They did it in different ways, no one
dictated the rules of the game. I remembered a quote from a colleague of mine:
"The organization of women's marches was a solidarity of Belarusian women, a
grassroots resistance which was not managed and not controlled, not by certain
women, not by the Belarusian authorities".

Women's marches were able to unite women, different women, all those who
understand that patriarchy is not an abstract concept, but the reality we are
experiencing. Women made up a large part of the participants in the mass rallies
and protests, and their voices and ideas were listened to by everyone, everyone
had to listen

The women's marches showed me personally that we have many women who share
feminist values, but do not call themselves feminists yet, and this is an
important beginning for change, too.

Can we imagine now that women's marches and actions would not have happened in
the past and what would be the outcome? Lots of other different protests, but no
women's protests. I think if society was ready for active and radical action,
there would have been some. Well somehow I don't see a crowd of radical
organizers and potential participants saying they didn't come out just because of us.

P: The last question will not be easy. Why didn't the regime die in your opinion
in 2020? It is clear that books and dissertations are written about this, but in
a nutshell.

S: I go over the different answers in my head, and I cannot latch on to one thing
in particular. Maybe because the whole country rebelled for the first time and
lacked experience. Maybe because many people who were against the regime did not
take to the streets anyway. Maybe because we have a lot of fucking cops in the
country. Either way, it's not over yet.


https://pramen.io/en/2023/03/an-interview-with-a-belarussian-anarchist-who-was-involved-in-organizing-women-s-marches-in-2020/
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